I dove deep into the world of Reddit and Blizzard Forums and
asked over 400 classic WoW players why they don’t enjoy retail.
Follow me on Twitch for occasional streams at https://www.twitch.tv/shieldsftw
Outro Music by youtube.com/@FantasyLofi
Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
01:20 Most Brought Up Topics
01:55 MMO Feeling
05:09 Power Progression
09:49 Focus On Endgame
11:32 Complexity
13:49 Warcraft Feeling
15:06 What Changes Classic Players Want
16:50 Tell Me What You Think
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I can't believe how many people are watching and commenting. Thank you again!
Go ask 400 live wow players why they don't like classic and you will learn why classic players don't like live.
p.s. good luck
I started playing on TBC and i still a huge fan of how classic works but having more than one job in real life, bills, and all those boring adult stuff i see myself with no time to spend gaming as i did 10+ years ago, so i play retail even knowing it's not the best WoW experience available. And also retails has infinite mana so that's a plus for casual gameplay.
Retail feel like single player wow private server…. And its dead easy full of sweats using addons acting elite but whenever they stop use addons they become the biggest noobs and that is why i started to hate retail… Elite people that act all like pro but are big noobs when addon gets taken away…
I love the attunement for raids it makes you feel worthy to raid for the most part. I only play SoD, and what they have done with it is amazing. Blizzard just needs to keep sod and posable build the game new from tbc on I lost interst in wow wrath and when cata destroyed the world I loved completely stopped playing and when cata was re-released I quit playing classic luckily SoD came out so I didn't cancel my account.
Really nice transmog what is it ❤
For me it was the constant shoving down our collective throats of gimmicky progression systems that are MEGA-Important in the current expansion and utterly irrelevant once the next expansion rolls around.
If you wanted to tell your players they are on an infinite treadmill without saying they are on an infinite treadmill…
Well, that's how you'd do it. It just feels pointless. At least in Vanilla getting the Vestments of Faith on my undead priest, named Faith, meant something.
I onky need 1 thing, and its leveling, last wexpansion i was playing was legion where leveling was good
When you guys talk about classic are you talking about cataclysm or just regular classic?
Retail RP servers are more active & social than classic servers & they dont die after a few years. More happening in the open world, more wpvp, more events, walk up conversations (doesnt have to be RP). Shit if you find an active guild?? Man you'll be finding yourself putting current content on the back burner. No one wants to have this conversation though
Retail made all the possible wrong decisions it could have, story wise, gameplay wise, monetisation wise, progression wise, everything is terrible. I would not be surprised if they revealed they where secretly owned by Disney this whole time.
I go between the two but one thing I felt is in retail everyone is needing me to do all their shit and it’s like 1000 people just needing me and it stresses me tf out. In classic there is no world is ending or army to destroy every 5 seconds just a fat boar named princess.
I like adding a new spell or skill to my hot bar every 30-60 minutes and working it into my rotation slowly instead of getting it all at once and having to just button mash basically.
Retail is pretty much beyond repair, it'd take less effort and time to launch WoW 2 rather than to fix retail to be what it was destined to be. The very name "retail" is kind of insulting to a videogame based on such a strong fantastic story line.
My biggest turn off that's not even named in this video is… The story aspect, I just don't play a MMORPG game that doesn't have an appealing, coherent and inmersive story. Watching a trailer from WotLK would make me SO excited, Legion kind of had the same feeling but Dragonflight… Shadowlands… CRINGE.
I could list like 30 more reasons why, but not going to far… the character you display in this video, the undead, man, transmog is out of control, it looks nothing like the original undead characters…
It embraced this korean tendency of making your character a fucking walking circus rather than staying true to a certain factions aesthetics.
Blizzard missed a HUGE opportunity implementing contemporary technical and graphical improvements to Classic, like Mounts inventory, upgraded character models, and for God's Sake… IMPROVED MAPS, YES, this maps were MIND BLOWING back in 2004, but If I never played WoW before, I couldn't tell if fucking Shattrath was designed yesterday or 20 years ago. The improvement is non existent.
I Played TBC Classic and I got bored within 1 week because people didn't interact or chat, that's nothing like my gaming experience from the OG version, I can't imagine playing Retail and finding it worse.
TLDR:
Contrary to popular belief, I am certain the situation is salvageable. If we ever see a good leadership willing to shake things up at first and slowly change the way decisions are made, we could restore MOST of the lost values and that "MMO feeling" that seem to have diminished with time. Of course compromises will need to be made by both sides, but if "the player/players" become the #1 priority then we have a shot at a future where everyone's mostly happy. Otherwise, we'd have to live in this "5 versions of wow"-reality where new players can't even pick where to play, let alone have even a tiny chance at getting attached to the game and making friends…
Read more:
And before the whales bring in the money topic I wanna say something. If your product is good the money will follow! Especially, with the PR the WOW brings to the table. It's a marketing rocket! You just gotta find the right fuel.
Ofc all the gatekeepers on both ends would need to suppress their egos and the company execs would need to find the right visionary to lead WOW into the future. But just how WOW revolutionized the MMO genre once and completely changed everything… I believe, that it can do it again, as long as the ship finds a bold helmsman to guide the wow ships into the sees of the future!
Something specific, for those willing to read. Just my idea on a starting point, but still not my decision to make, just an idea.
And because I'd like to get into one specific thing I believe should be the starting point, in terms of decision making and problem solving, were they to change in the future in an attempt to reach a brighter future and that is:
In my opinion a good expansion to take as a starting point is WotLK. The game still had the EXACT same feeling like in vanilla, but without most of the problems and imperfections (except the cute ones xD) that vanilla had. So let's look how were vanilla issues solved during tbc and wotlk, without blizz breaking the game. If the old devs could find a way to solve problems, modernize the game and invent new content, without breaking the "MMO feeling", without changing the pace too much, without making it a constant FOMO experience, than maybe there is a lot of lessons, that should've been learned by the newer devs, but weren't. And when I say devs, I mean the whole team, inc Ion and even those above him. It only takes one person with a bold idea and someone to convince the execs to give it a shot and then the whole "game" changes and devs can actually work on something they love, instead of finding a way to milk millions with 5 recolors of the same mount, or creating a "new" version of "vanilla with a twist" every few months to cater to both sides of the spectrum.. I am telling you people, whilst we're bickering between ourselves, NEITHER version of the game can thrive and last for years to come! So you gotta swallow your pride and try speaking to each other and figure out the solutions to the problems you're having, instead of just pointing them out and being dead set on not giving a different concept a try.
I played warlock through cataclysm, then in MOP, they destroyed the class and I wasn't going to start over. The game is so dumbed down now to keep pumping dopamine that it's just unappealing.
Answer: they dont like to be challenged 🙏🏼
This video made me realize the classic players are right and retail rly is only good for roleplaying.
I’ve literally been playing classic wow on Kronos, for like 8 years, and now that hardcore is out, I finally caved and started paying to play wow again, and I don’t touch retail, I’ve been on hardcore for 3 months and it added a whole new level of challenge and fun to it, I feel like I’m reliving my teenage years as far as enjoying the game again goes, even tho, I still haven’t out grown it, I would still be playing Kronos if it weren’t for hardcore. Imo. They ruined the game I grew to love as a teen and I quit shortly after they released MoP. I was not that thrilled with lich king, I did enjoy it some but I was not a fan of all the changes and then when MoP came, I was just over it. I then played on private servers from MoP until 3 months ago. I have watched retail played and it just looks way over done and too chaotic, as usual. I’ll stick w classic as long as I can, and when I can’t, I’ll quit.
In BFA the story is that you get a amulet, but everyone get one and what should make you feel uniqe and powerful, makes you feel like a massproduction that is weak because you dont have time to min/max your gear
"Retail feels like single player action RPG" is the best explanation, especially for me, who tried this game out 4 months ago and played like 70h. There is so much going on, I so often tried to speak to other people, was looking for active guilds for like 3 weeks straight on Discord and the WoW site, but still you feel so lonely. I cannot say, that Classic WoW is my favorite MMORPG of all time, since I'm playing many other MMORPGs, but WoW Classic feels so much more alive even with fewer people. You can communicate with them, group with them, and I've found a great guild on the Anniversary realm. But however, for a first time adventure and MSQ, WoW Retail was definitely really fun for like 50h straight, but as a Single Player ARPG.
In Classic – healers felt very applicable and needed. Each part of the tank/dps/healz trinity was needed to really survive a dungeon.
I remember in retail there came a point where it felt pointless to be a healer unless you were an amazing player and healed high level keys.
Lastly for me, I’m not the best player but I really enjoy the game. In retail it feels like unless you’re an amazing player, your gear will always be 2nd or 3rd tear.
Mmo feeling is being in a desert doing quests in your green gear (creaturs dont die in 10seconds) and seeing other players around being same like you. (And theres no stupid flying around)
Played the game since release(with some breaks, some longer than others), and nothing can come close to the feeling I had stepping into this world when it first released. I love that they have the classic servers to try and recreate those feelings, though not exactly the same. Opinion wise, I agree with some of the things being said here, specifically around how fast the leveling experience is in retail and the feeling of being alone in places/population across all zones. At some point, as with other mmorpg's(looking at you ESO), they tried catering to new players in making it easier to catch up to everyone else and get to that current content quicker, at a detriment to the player base that has enjoyed that slow paced feel of the games past. I'm all about the story and connecting with what I'm doing, and I it becomes difficult to stay motivated and complete those story lines when you've been max level since zone 2 of 5. On the population, love that we have these classic servers, but i do think it hurts the current version/content of the game. When I look at my friends list of folks I've been playing with since launch, some are in classic, some are in classic hard-core, and some are in retail. So many options thinning out the population across the game in general. This becomes more noticeable in retail when dealing with a far larger game.
For me it’s the story
As someone who’s played retail for 2 months I wanna try classic but I don’t know how I’d start in it, I had a friend help me with retail but the problem I ah e with retail is once I reach the max level I no longer have any motivation to do side quests anymore, the gear they give usually suck, I never know if I’ll get a nice piece for transmog and I realize I’m just in the expansion zone only and I’d like to explore the rest of the world outside of storm wind but I have no motivation to do the side quests because I don’t wanna do chores alone with nobody around
What I would do to go back to when the level cap was 50-60. I miss the old days
RETAIL sucks and is made for CHOMPS! MAN UP and play HARCORE.
Just a small detail. I think you mean “asocial” not “antisocial.” “Antisocial” is a clinical word that describes sociopaths.
I just hope blizzard becomes so fking woke and stupid that they sell wow, and another company makes wow 2
I like the new races and class opinion that come with retail but retail feels so… over cluttered at this point that if I start playing I’ll be level 30 by the 10 minute mark for working on professions while dungeoning and questing. It feels like a conveyor belt getting me ready for raiding. The word “soulless” comes to mind for gameplay I could play retail for 30 minutes and feel like I’m working a job instead of playing a game. Meanwhile I can play an hour in classic and it feels like 10 minutes went by cause I’m having so much fun.
I've always felt that the main underlying reason people dont like retail is simply because they dont like change. You absolutely do not need to read any developer blogs to play retail -I never have and get along just fine even after years of being away. The same concepts from the beginning apply. Do your quests, get to max level, get raid appropriate gear, go raid or go pvp. Same thing! The only difference is the community aspect which is easily the biggest issue but can be solved by seeking out guilds.
if classic looked like retail or better, with new items and cool things i would like it, but playing hours for my character look ugly as F its not my type of game anymore,in 2006 the wow looked hyper realistic for me but now i see it and it needs an update honestly,blizzard have the money to develop a new engine and make a turtle wow or something like that but they are lazy.
Many things. Retail took playing the game out of the game. I recall noticing the sped up nature as early as BC and it only got worse. I took a break and when I came back the most obvious changes were no longer having to play your class in instances. I asked which mob to trap and got laughed at. It was basically speed through the instance pulling as many mobs as your wanted, get the reward and get out. But what made me walk away from retail for good some 14 years ago was the endgame grind. Classic is by no means perfect, but for me it's more enjoyable for longer.
And yet when I head to the WoW forums and suggest they take all the good things from classic and put them into retail, I'm trolled harder than Madona sing like a virgin…
Retail is too easy to feel like wow, i never played in 2005 and i started in 2023 on retail, it was fun for a little bit but then i saw wow classic. It was so simple but so grindy and that is exactly how it feels
Retail is just too much everything. It feels like there are 78 progression systems you have to go through, the professions feel like a mess. I hit level cap shortly after the war withins launch and I had no idea what to actually do from there and there was so much going on that i got overwhelmed and I have not done a single heroic or above to this point. Also the change to the talent system alone made me close out of the game the first few times i opened it after they made the change. There is just so much wrong with it. I hate it and I hate that I hate it.